00:02:46
Hello and welcome to her Her Empire Builder show. I'm your business strategist and host, Tina Tower, and I am so happy you are here. My goal with this show is to bring you the inspirational and informative conversations with interesting humans, as well as the tools, tips, and resources to help you build your online business. Since starting my first business at 20, I have built and sold four times. And in 2018, while traveling around the world with my family for a year, I tripped and fell into this wonderful world of online courses, and I instantly fell in love.

00:03:22
I'm a million dollar course creator, a world traveler, bestselling author, a mummer of two man children, and a lucky wife. There's no playing small here. It's your time to grow to run a highly profitable business that makes you wildly wealthy while you positively impact your clients and the world around you and have the life you've always dreamed of. Let's get it. Okay.

00:03:48
Welcome to her Her Empire Builder show, the fabulous Kajabi expert Meg Burrage. Ah. Hello, Tina. Thank you so much for having me. Expert Meg Burrage.

00:03:59
I didn't enunciate my words properly, but funny, isn't it? It doesn't matter how long you've been doing this job. I'm like, expert? I don't know. Would you call me an expert?

00:04:08
I'm sure there's still things I don't know. Oh, always. Always. But you actually, like, I would think I know my way around Kajabi pretty well. And you run a session last week inside her Her Empire Builder, and there was, like, three things that I was.

00:04:24
I didn't know you could do that. That's amazing. So I think everyone picks up their own little things, and it's not unless we talk to each other that we realize, oh, we can do that, too. And we can do that, too. It's fantastic.

00:04:35
Fantastic. Absolutely. Right now, actually, I'm recording a series, and I don't normally these days do a lot of, like, done for you type kajabi work. So I, you know, have in my mind how it used to be a couple of years ago, and I got in there to record this series, and I was like, oh, didn't know it did that. Oh, this is fancy beaches.

00:04:55
But, you know, Kajabi just evolved so quickly that you feel like you just blink and all of a sudden the landscape's completely changed. Yeah, I have been caught a couple of times when I go in to demonstrate for people on different things and I go, go to click the button and it's no longer there. And I go, oh, hang on. Nope, over this side.

00:05:14
Yeah, I 100% get it. But yes, I love the Kajabi tool. And for anyone who's thinking, what the heck even is Kajabi? Should we tell them, Tina? We should tell them.

00:05:24
But I think most listeners of my show will know, but we can tell them just in case. They're like, these guys have gone off on a tangent. What the heck are they talking about? For anyone who is listening to us, Kajabi is like an awesome replacement for any other web platform that you might be using if you are a course creator, a coach, a membership builder. So it's a learning management platform that will help you to house your content and charge people for your content and build your website and send your emails and, like, all the things.

00:05:57
Yeah. And, Meg, how long have you been playing on Kajabi for? Since 2019. The beginning of 2019. Nice.

00:06:07
And what led you to get started with your journey with them? Were you a web developer in other software first? No. Before Kajabi, I was working as a management consultant in oil and gas, which was the world's most boring job ever, and I had maternity leave coming up, so I was, like, about six months pregnant and I thought, what? What can I create as a business while I'm on maternity leave?

00:06:35
That means I won't have to go back to this super boring job. And I've been dabbling with Kajabi as part of a program I was in and thought, you know, I reckon I could do this kajabi thing for a living. Like, it's pretty fun and lots of people seem to need help with it, so I'll just offer this as a service. And there was just crazy demand for it. Yeah, yeah, I totally agree.

00:06:57
Yeah, you started, like, just. We started 20. The beginning of. End of 2017, start of 2018, I think, was when I made my first dollar on there. So, yeah, like, the same era there.

00:07:11
And it was like, we've seen a lot in the last five years. Like, the changes have been huge, both to the platform and the course creator landscape as a whole. What have been, like, the biggest changes that you've seen to course creators? I think, you know, COVID time was crazy, right? Like, things were just exploding and I feel like a lot of people who were in the space in that time made a lot of sales very easily because everyone was coming online and they maybe like, in a lot of instances, I think people got a bit complacent.

00:07:50
So now COVID's kind and the world's gone back to normality. And a lot of people have seen, like, their sales dropping off because I think they're not very good at, you know, pivoting or adjusting their offers. You know, they just, they got so comfortable during COVID of things just going gangbusters that when things just went back to normal, they were like, oh, I don't really know how to make this work anymore. Yes. I think.

00:08:16
I don't know. It's complacency as much as people thought it was normal. So a lot of people that came in were like, oh, this is what we do and this is how it works. And then when that boom kind of stopped, people were like, oh, what? What do we have to do now?

00:08:29
Like, that's too hard. And of course, a lot of the rhetoric inside the course industry is passive income. And it's so easy to make money in two minutes a day. Yeah, I know, right? And nowadays, I think even more than ever, I think, you know, personal attention is the new currency.

00:08:48
It's like selling things on just passive evergreen, diy it yourself, you know, people don't want to pay big bucks for that sort of stuff. You know, they want handheld. They want people to do it for them. They want, you know, one on one coaching. And there's still amazing ways out there that you can be generating great revenue in this business.

00:09:08
But I think you have to sort of listen to the landscape, you know, and what people are asking them for and then give them that. Totally. And I think, like, I know across our members as well, like, the hybrid programs are the one that ones that we're seeing the most successful that are supported by online components but also have live elements in there where people are showing up and they're communicating with their clients and they're giving that extra layer of love and care in there as well. Yeah. And if you can couple it with something like in person, in real life events, then amazing, right?

00:09:41
Like, I know your retreats are amazing. And, you know, I go all out for hours. Oh, my goodness. One day I'm going to come to one, Tina. But people are in a position to have in person events that just, you know, that's huge right now because people are just craving that, like, give me something that's off of Zoom.

00:10:01
Yes, totally. And you work with, like, now you don't create people's kajabi sites. So talk to us about how has your business model evolved over the past five years? And actually now we do create people's kajabi sites. So, you know, we've sort of done a 180 on that.

00:10:18
But I started off back in 2019 building kajabi sites. Then I started like one on one coaching with people who wanted to sort of learn it and have it done for them. Then I decided, look, it's that time I created my own online course. So I created a program and a whole lot of group coaching around teaching people kajabi. It was like a twelve week program.

00:10:42
And then I introduced templates, which was great because, you know, people are happy to pay for a shortcut. So we brought out a ranger template. Yeah. And then we decided to make our move from the Netherlands back to Australia this year. And I just knew that group coaching with all my american clients was going to be basically impossible because I do not like being on calls after dinner time.

00:11:08
You know, like once I switch off my laptop, at the end of the day, I just, I feel resentment brewing if I have to switch my computer back on. And I hate that feeling. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, how can I, being self. Employed is that we can craft something that works for us.

00:11:22
Absolutely. And I thought, what am I going to craft going forward that isn't going to fill me with resentment? People, I think we should go back to, like, done for you services. You know, people would love to have it done for them. They're happy to pay for it.

00:11:35
We have, you know, so many years of experience doing it now that we can create things for people that actually work and we can do it in our own time. So the done for you stuff has made a big resurgence inside of my business, and then we've added on our collaboration station arm of the business, helping people to find online collaborations to launch their programs. And we're just working on a template shop for that. So templates that are specific to collaborating, like summits and podcasts and that sort of stuff. Fantastic.

00:12:06
Fantastic. And so with all the sites that you build, what are the commonalities that you think that you see people that become successful have at the beginning? I think the ones that I see make a lot of make, get a lot of traction are the ones who don't overcomplicate things. You know, they don't offer like, a gazillion things and, you know, confuse their audience with where they should start. It's the people who have just laser focused on, like, one core offer and a way to get that core offer and just kept it, like, super simple.

00:12:46
I think there's a definite trend around people who just become prolific creators and it just takes them forever to bring things to market. They delay themselves and then they bring all these things to market and people are like, I don't know where to start. Which offer do I go for? So I think keeping it simple is definitely a big one. But also, you know, it's weird, but I quite like working with my male clients because they just get on with it, you know, like, the women are so good at, like, being perfectionists, and it's got to be perfect before I start.

00:13:21
I want to have all the training created perfectly before I sell this thing. And the guys are more like, let's just give it a go, you know? Let's just put it out there and see who buys. Yeah. Do you think it's perfectionism or do you think it's like the fear of showing up or both?

00:13:36
I think. I think it's a combination, right? Because they're like, people are going to judge me, so it's got to be perfect. You know, it's. Yeah, I'm.

00:13:44
I'm worried to put myself out there and all my peers are going to see it and it's got to be like, absolutely amazing. Like, it's got to be Tina Tower standards, you know, and it's like, well, no one's going to say that like that. Like, when I went through my website the other day, there's so many things wrong. That's the thing that I like to say to people at the start is going, you know, we pay attention to things and I have a certain level of excellence that I want. When I say this thing's wrong, there's.

00:14:12
There's nothing crappy on there. Like, there's a high standard, but there's things that have not been updated in a really long time that need desperate attention to that. That if you were looking at it through my eyes, it's, like, horrifying, but nobody else would really know that. And so often I will talk to people in going, like, your website is going to be brand shiny new at the start, but then you're going to start making money and you're going to get all that traction. You've got to remember it's never over.

00:14:40
Like, it's not like a website reaches its finish line and is done. It is never finished. A good website will be changed all the time. Do you see that? People will often put a lot of effort into the startup, but then forget the maintenance so much.

00:14:55
I mean, even in my own, every now and again I'll get on my website. I forgot to switch off that exit pop that's promoting that workshop I did last month. You know, it's like remembering to come back and do things, especially on your homepage. You know, like, we're in a launch right now. I haven't even put it on my website.

00:15:10
You know, I spent all this effort going, it should be like, in the announcement bar at the top. Yes, it should. That as soon as we get off this call. But, you know, I get so caught up with sending the emails to the list and prepping the Facebook ads, and I'm just like, the actual website of mine, I very, very rarely come back to it. So, you know, yeah, I met about once a year, I get so tired with the design of my website, and I'm like, let's just roll it all out and start again.

00:15:41
Oh, my gosh. I couldn't do that, though. I have 400 pages on my website, so it's one thing by one thing. I changed the logo two years ago, and that was one page at a time, having to upload it, and I was like, no, that again. I know.

00:15:58
I'd love to be somebody who can just, like, stick with one thing and not get bored, you know? You gotta keep it fresh, though. That's part of the fresh. I'm like, yeah, sometimes you just feel like it doesn't reflect you anymore. It's like, oh, you know, this just doesn't feel like me.

00:16:11
I want to do something different, so. Yeah, but absolutely. And I think people need to just not spend a whole lot of time on their website because much more important is, like, the funnel that's going to get people into your program. You know, you don't even really need the website part, but you've got to have a way to, like, collect the email addresses, send the emails, you know, promote your webinar, have the sales page. You know, the homepage and the about page are kind of like, nice to have.

00:16:39
Yes. The about page is actually the page I looked at the other day and went, there's some photos there still from 2019. People do love that stuff, right? Once they start to stalk you online, they're like, oh, let me go and dig into the about page and read all about this person. So it's great to have it.

00:16:56
Yeah. Whenever we look at the analytics, I'm like, I really need to update those pages. Yes, I'm off to look at your about page. Straight after this? No.

00:17:04
Hopefully by the time this episode airs, I fixed it. But what do you think with everyone so busy, when you do like a monthly check of your website, is there normal maintenance? What do you think is the main thing, the most important thing for people to keep up to date all the time? I think it's mostly, you know, links, you know, making sure that you're not promoting things that are now going to, like, 404 pages because you set them to draft or decided to do something else. Often when I'm working with clients, you know, sales pages will have countdown clocks on them.

00:17:39
Where the countdown clock expired, but the page is still up. You know, it's like, oh, that early bird ended like three months ago, guys. Yeah, maybe you should remove that bit. Yeah, but, you know, it's. I think if you.

00:17:51
You could easily, I think, put together a checklist, couldn't you? Like things you should check on your website each month and. Yeah, yeah. And I have our countdown. Yep.

00:18:02
Countdown clocks, links, making sure that, you know, offers and things are not expired coupons. One of the things, actually, that I've noticed, and thanks for reminding me, but I keep seeing, like, pop up in my inbox, people redeeming something that I was giving away for free, like six months ago. And I kind of thought I got rid of that. Freebies, like, everywhere. But obviously people are still finding it somewhere and it's worth like $200.

00:18:29
And every time I see it pop up in my inbox, I'm like, I need to go and switch off that coupon code so that it doesn't work anymore. I keep forgetting. I totally understand that. Yes. When we did our last launch, we had someone in pre launch, like three weeks before doors opened that joined, and we could not figure out how everything was set to waitlist.

00:18:50
Everything was there. And then I'd asked her how she joined. I'm like, it's totally fine that you're here. Welcome. How did you get the link to be able to get into that?

00:18:58
She's like, I don't know. I was clicking many things and I looked at all her history and she downloaded like eight different lead magnets. Opted into all the trainings, all, everything. I'm like, we could not find how. Must have been an old link somewhere, going somewhere.

00:19:12
You know, it's something else that happens quite often now is someone will just, like, put my name into Google and Google will serve them up. A whole lot of pages that are now, like, no longer relevant. So, you know, pages that I've accidentally left as published and I've left on the little toggle that allows Google to go and search it and it will, you know, every now and again, randomly, someone joins something that you don't even own, like, you don't even run it anymore and you're like, holy, holy cow. I'm going to have to recognize everyone. To go into your page settings and go down to SEO settings and turn it off if you no longer want it to be shown in search engines and if you do, to update that section, because I see so many people that don't update that section on all of their pages too.

00:19:54
Absolutely. Yep. 100% patches us all out. So if you're listening to this and you're like, that's happened to me, don't worry, you're not alone. Yeah.

00:20:02
So talk to me about the difference between using templates and building a kajabi site from scratch. You know, for us, templates came about because we were building from scratch, we were working with clients and we'd be reinventing the wheel over and over again. And the thing is, like most people, same sections on their pages, you know, it's going to look different. But most people want to talk about their podcast or like promote their three main offers, you know, and it was just not time efficient to be starting from scratch when the structure for most of these websites was pretty much the same. And we just said, look, we should just create internally three or four templates and ask our clients to just pick one as a starting point.

00:20:49
So we started with that and then somebody called Windavant and said, can you sell it to me? And it was like, oh, yeah, why not? Let's create a template store. And before we knew it, that became like one of our biggest streams of revenue. But I think, you know, so much can be done with templates that often people will reach out to me and say, which of your designs would you recommend for, like, XYz?

00:21:10
Yeah. And I, and I say to them, like, don't you know, when you're looking at comparing my templates, don't look too much at the branding of it, look at the structure, look at the way that we've put the blocks and just see, like, can you imagine putting your content into those blocks? Because once you apply your own photos and your own colors and your own fonts, it's completely different. Every now and again someone will jump into the kajabi group and tag me and say, oh, I got a template from beg barrage and I've just created the most amazing sales page. And I'll be like, oh, I'd love to see it.

00:21:44
He put a link and they might put the link, and we look at it and they're like, oh, that's horrible. Was that from one of our templates? Like, it's so unrecognizable. Sometimes they do a great job with it, and sometimes, you know, design's not your thing. They can turn it into something where you're like, holy smokes.

00:21:59
Did that even start as our template? I hope not. And what do you think makes it horrible? Do you think the branding colors or putting too much content on? What are the elements that you look at?

00:22:08
And you go, mm mm. Not how the template was supposed to be? Yes, that's right. It's usually. It's usually three things I see.

00:22:16
Mostly it's either colors have been put together that are just like that. You know, that palette's just gross. You're like, why? What made you think that those colors worked? And there's many resources.

00:22:28
You can go to guys where, you know, you could put in a color that you love and it will give you back complementary colors to work with. Like, here's the suggested palette. I will link to a tool in the show notes. That'd be great. So, yeah, firstly, the colors second, and I get it that this is a limitation for people that's hard to get past sometimes, but the photos, like, your own images on the site, it's just so worthwhile getting some branded photos, a photo shoot done.

00:22:57
And if you have financial limitations that make that not possible, even just getting someone who is good on a smartphone, like, can take great photos, you know? But it is difficult to build a nice website, nice sales page with horrible photos, you know, and 100% yes. And then I think the third thing is just. It's more of like, I'm just now it's me being the perfectionist. But attention.

00:23:25
Attention to detail on things. Like, you know, you line up three images and the images are not the same dimensions. Yes. And then everything's out of alignment. That is my bug there.

00:23:34
I don't think that's perfectionism. I think that just neat. It's the same with, like, not having top aligned and they're all higgity piggy. You can't do it like that, you know? So.

00:23:47
Yes, then they're the three that I would see the most. Most often. Yes. Yeah. They're good ones for people to be aware of.

00:23:54
And so the opposite would be true. The ones that you see use your templates and different things, and you're like, that looks good. They have beautiful branding, clear, concise, clean. They've got their photos all done. It all makes sense.

00:24:06
And it's all neat. Absolutely. We had someone the other day send us her website built on our quirk and squiggle template. And quirk and squiggle has never been a good seller for us. Like, we branded it craft.

00:24:20
And I think a lot of people who were not craft could not see past the fact that it had all these craft photos in it, so they didn't have the vision for it that I had when, you know, I was like, just put in photos of guitars or, like, just put in photos of whatever, they couldn't see it. And so when this lady sent us her website and showed us what she'd done with her, I was like, that's amazing. And it's so good that I went back to her and said, would you mind if we, like, rebrand our quirk and squiggle in line with your website? And so that process is happening right now in the background where we're completely changing out. It's still the same structure, but it'll be different images and a completely different color palette.

00:24:58
And it's very exciting because it looks amazing. You'll like it, actually. And you do have a Tina template also. We do have a Tina template, which everybody loves, you know, it's just good. It's the energy, right, of your website and similar for anyone who's listening, that came about because I was on Tina's website and I was just like, this website is so cool.

00:25:19
We should collaborate and create, like, a Tina template that is just modeled off your website, which was one of the. Most exciting things to have happen to me to go, can we make a template out of you? And I was like, there was the Amy template and then the Tina template, and I was like, yes, that's exciting. Yes. I'm so glad that we made your day on that one.

00:25:44
But, you know, it has been a wonderful template. We love working with it because it's just fun, you know, it just brings so much energy inside and it makes. Like, it does what you said before. It saves people so much time. Like, I love.

00:25:57
I recommend your templates all the time because I think that not only is it saving time and going, how do I create that block? Where do I go? There? But also the suggestion of this type of text here and then this type of text here and this much, the dot points over here. It just takes away a bit of that blank screen.

00:26:16
Where do I start feeling? Absolutely. I agree. I think templates are a big time saver for people. And if you're going to get a custom site done, like, easily, you're going to spend four to $5,000 depending on how many pages you're going to want on your website.

00:26:33
I think if you can find a template out there, it doesn't have to be mine, but, you know, if you can find a template out there, it's amazing how different you can make it with your own branding applied. And the time saving is huge. Yeah, totally. So I want to ask you about life as well, because it's one of the main reasons I wanted you on the podcast, because I'm like, I love people that live, like, a life less ordinary. And one of the things that I think is the greatest thing about running our own businesses is that we have location freedom.

00:27:03
And I think that sometimes we can forget that being self employed means we can go anywhere whenever we want and do whatever we want whenever we want. And we fall into the trap of, like, having a traditional job, even though we don't have one. So that's what I want to ask you about. When did you leave Australia? And welcome back.

00:27:21
You've just got back to Australia, but can you talk to us about how that trip came about and what your travels were like? Yeah, sure. So back in 2019 was when I got on into the online space, and I sort of been three months in, and our second child was born. And so we were just running the business from home, and I had an assistant who was also a nanny. And, you know, between the two of us, we were juggling the baby and cooking dinner and feeding the cat and building hijabi websites, and it was all great.

00:27:53
And then nine months later, I realized I was pregnant again. So I was like, holy heck, I'm about to have, like, two under two. What are we gonna do about this? So I had, by that stage, an actual full time nanny helping me along with my assistant. So our household was just run by women, husband, and go off to work, and the three of us had sort everything out.

00:28:14
I love that. It was lots of fun. But my nanny, lovely french lady, her Australia work visa was up, and so she was having to leave the country, and COVID had just, like, hit. And we were like, okay, well, we'd planned at some point to go to the Netherlands and, you know, just be closer to my husband's family because he's Dutch. And also when he became australian, he lost his dutch citizenship, so he was going to have to live in the Netherlands for a year to get it back.

00:28:45
And so we were like, well, maybe we should just go now. Like, Australia's going into this COVID lockdown. We should just, like, get out of here. And we applied to the government, and. They didn't go into lockdown in the Netherlands.

00:28:58
There was a lockdown. It was pretty horrible, actually. Like, we got there in December of 2020. Great flight. We had the plane to ourselves.

00:29:06
Was amazing. It would have been weird. Yeah, it was weird. It was even better that we were in first class. We used our points to buy, like, first class tickets to the Netherlands and had, like, the whole plane to.

00:29:18
Yeah, that was great. But, yeah, we got over there, and about two weeks after arriving, the Netherlands went into lockdown. So mid December until April, and everything was shut. It was like, the kids could go to school, but all restaurants, playgrounds. Like, it was winter, so you couldn't do an outside playground.

00:29:40
So it's like, inside playgrounds, restaurants, shops, everything closed. And it was so, so boring. Like, trying to entertain kids in the middle of winter with everything shut. Living in an apartment, we were going a bit crazy. But on the pros side, we did have his mum and we had his brother and our nanny, our french nanny, who had to leave Australia, came with us to the Netherlands and has been.

00:30:05
Yes, she was with us, like, a further three years. And so we went to the Netherlands with a two year plan. And after the first winter, I think it was the first winter, yeah, after the first winter, we were like, we can't do another winter here. Where else could we go? Let's go and try living in the Caribbean.

00:30:23
We just tick that. The opposite of doing a european winter. Yes, that's right. Where else can we go that's on the same calendar year. School calendar.

00:30:32
So we went over to Anguilla in the Caribbean, and my husband had grown up in the Caribbean, so he, like, knew what. What we were in for. And I was like, yeah, I'm willing to give it a go. So we went over there initially for five months, and actually, well, in the beginning, Tina, it was great. Like, we spent the first six weeks thinking, why would you live anywhere else?

00:30:53
Like, I'm just having cocktails at my desk at 03:00 and then I'm going to the beach for a sunset swim. And life was so good. We. We put in an offer on a house. Thank goodness they said no.

00:31:05
And we were like, yeah, we're going to live here forever. But about the eight week mark, just the novelty of being on an island where all there was to do was go to the beach, just wore off. Like, okay, there is interesting. Yes. You know, and it was.

00:31:20
It was a really fancy island, so anytime you went out, cost you a fortune. It was all, like, high end restaurants and things. Like, you couldn't just go out for a cheap burger. Like, you know, to take our family of five out was, like, easily $200. We were like, okay, this is getting very expensive and also getting very boring.

00:31:38
You know, every weekend you'd look at the kids and be like, which beach will we go to? Like, I don't want to go to the beach. It's like, well, that's all there is to do. This beach or this beach. So we actually changed our flights to come back to the Netherlands a month early after four months, and cancelled our lease.

00:31:56
And the Netherlands looked pretty good after that. We're like, oh, you know, the Netherlands. And it's cold weather is not so bad. At least there's a lot of things to keep kids occupied. I love that because it's.

00:32:07
I mean, I don't love for you that it didn't turn out how you wanted it to, but I love that. I mean, to everyone, I think. Well, to a lot of people, I think living on a caribbean island would sound so ideal that I'm always interested when what we imagine is very different to that. And so for you, it was the boredom of it. The boredom, yeah.

00:32:32
And, you know, I. I didn't have an office like I had in the Netherlands. I was just working from home and not being able to, you know, separate work and life, like work and home life, but, yeah, just. Just boredom, really. And because I'm pretty sure I could live on an island.

00:32:51
Could your kids do it, though? Well, my kids are grown so, so different right now at 15 and 16. No, they wouldn't live on an island unless there was surf. Then they would surf and a golf course, they would be there. But other than that, no, but I would.

00:33:10
An amazing golf course. I put my. My nine year old into golf lessons at the golf club, but sadly, that's not the sport for him. So he didn't love it. But I enjoyed sitting in the clubhouse, you know, drinking my champagne while he was playing golf once a week.

00:33:25
Yeah. Yeah. Other than the golf course, there was nothing. And the Netherlands did look pretty good afterwards. But for sure, things often just sound so amazing.

00:33:35
And it's wonderful to have the freedom and flexibility, but it's not always glamorous. And we just moved back this year, and we shipped our sea container and arrived in Australia with, like, just what was in our suitcases. So the first six weeks here, we've just been sleeping on air mattresses in an old rental that we found because the rental market's horrible here. Definitely. We've got a lot of freedom and flexibility, but it's not always what you see on Instagram.

00:34:01
Yeah, yeah. And it's nice that, like, you don't feel now that the grass is greener on the other side. Like, you've tried all the sides. And so you can now go, this is what makes me happy for this chapter of my life. Absolutely.

00:34:13
All I need now, Tina, is some friends. Like, I feel like we were out of the country for quite a few years, and I sort of. I'm not very good at keeping in contact with people. So now that I'm back, you know, worlds just evolve, right? Lives evolve, and I'm like, I need to find, like, a new group of entrepreneurial people who are on my wavelength.

00:34:33
I don't know where to start with that. Yes. Yes, I do. I'll hook you up. But I always think business is, like, business is such a gateway to making friends.

00:34:44
Like, it has opened so many doors for me in terms of. I mean, this is my 20th year in business, so I've been going for a long time, but I'm just, like, running through my head now, going, I think pretty much nearly every one of my great friends. Like, I think my best ten friends, they've all got businesses. Yeah. And I don't.

00:35:05
I don't actually really have anyone over here. We're going to get you out. Networking, Meg. Yes, please. Can you do that?

00:35:10
So I started to look at online. Yes. All the networking groups I found are sort of people with local businesses. And I'm like, people on my, you know, doing sort of similar stuff that we can talk about, for sure. Yeah, I will talk about that after.

00:35:28
We'll get great. Meg Kajavi using wonderful course, creative friends. I know many. So, my final question, now that you're back, what does a successful life and business look like to you? Well, now that I'm back, it's like the first time since I started this business where I actually have to parent.

00:35:51
And we've come back without our nanny. And I am finally understanding what it means to run a business in school hours. So I can't say I have nailed that yet, but that is what I see as success. It's like, okay, if I can actually run my business without being super stressed, get it all done in the space of 5 hours a day, and I'm such a workaholic that will easily sit at my desk for 9 hours, you know, without doing anything. I know this year it's got to be the same revenue with half the time.

00:36:23
And if I can do that, then I have. I've made it. Yes. Do you know, I often think I wish I was as productive as when I had small children because I would fit it into those school hours. I would stop as soon as they got home at 03:00 and then I fit everything in.

00:36:41
But now that I have the luxury of more time, I don't think, I procrasTinate. I don't take longer to do things. I just do more things. And so I will give myself liberty with more ideas and more experimentation. Whereas before it was like it's results or nothing.

00:36:56
I got no time for anything else, which has positives and negatives. I've been in the position you're in now for the last three years where I've had a full time nanny and a husband not at work. So, you know, I could leave and go to the opposite at nine and come home at six in time for dinner and pack so many new ideas and projects into my day. And now I find I'm, like, still trying to do that in a five hour window. And after school, I'm picking up kids and it's dance class and it's horse riding and it's like Minecraft school and, like, all the things.

00:37:28
And I'm just like, okay, I'm giving myself a breakdown. I need to learn how to, like, curb my enthusiasm for all these new projects and get a bit more realistic with what's achievable. Yes, I think a lot of people can relate to what you're saying right now because it is. There's so many of our listeners that will have young children that are fitting it in between school hours, that have second jobs, that have other bricks and mortar businesses, and they're running online on the side. Like, there's so many things that people are trying to fit into one.

00:37:59
And I do know that sometimes we can forget, like, there's enough time, it can happen later. We don't need everything. Patience is not my strong point. Tina, I have an idea. I want this rolled out in two weeks.

00:38:11
Yes, I totally understand and I relate, but it's a learned skill that I have worked on a lot.

00:38:19
I get it. I get it. Okay. Where can people find you, Meg? Well, I'm not very good on instagram, so don't go there.

00:38:26
Maybe my website is probably a simple spot to start. So just Meg worried to one of Meg's lead magnets in the notes below so that you can find her and get some freebies in there as well. Oh, that's a good, good plan. Thanks, Tina. Thank you so much for having me in.

00:38:41
I had lots of fun. Thanks, Meg. This episode was brought to you by my signature group coaching program, her Her Empire Builder. The best online education for female course creators in the world. Check it [email protected].

00:38:56
Along with so many free resources to help you get building your empire and seeing those results that you deserve. If you loved this episode, please don't keep it a secret. Share it with a friend on social media and tag Tina Tower and give it a review. It really does help us to be able to bring you bigger and better content as we grow. Have the most beautiful day.

00:39:21
I'm Tina Tower, and I'm cheering you on all the way.